双语 | 特朗普胜选后接受专访 或许这才是真实的他（视频+重点摘录）

当地时间11月9日，美国总统选举初步结果揭晓，共和党总统候选人唐纳德·特朗普战胜民主党候选人、前国务卿希拉里·克林顿赢得总统选举，将成为美国第四十五任总统。

至此，长达18个月激烈的、充满争议的、戏剧性的，甚至“肮脏的”选举大战终于落下帷幕。无论此前受到多少主流媒体打压、两党高层的嫌弃，甚至目前依然在爆发的部分民众的愤怒，地产商、政治圈“门外汉”特朗普终将于明年1月20日，接手管理这个世界上最受人议论的国度。

此时此刻，特朗普在想什么？他备受称赞的子女，曾数次陷入争议的妻子，又如何看待这最新的挑战？当地时间11月11日，特朗普在赢得美国大选后首次接受了媒体采访。他挑选了美国哥伦比亚广播公司（CBS）知名时事节目《60分钟》，这档开播长达40年的节目也曾专访过中国前国家领导人邓小平、江泽民，知名体育明星李娜等人。

在访谈中，特朗普先后回应了大选日当晚的感受，与希拉里、克林顿、奥巴马的短暂交流，是否会兑现参选期间许下的承诺，是否会调查希拉里，怎样看待美国部分民众的反特朗普游行，如何确定内阁人选，是否会继续使用社交媒体等外界最为关心的问题。妻子梅拉尼娅、女儿伊万卡等人也都有专门的回答。

这次采访在纽约特朗普大厦进行，同时接受采访的还有特朗普的妻子及四个子女。CBS在当地时间11月13日播出了这一专访。以下是我们对专访内容的重点摘录↓↓↓

（一）当选当晚的感受

https://v.qq.com/txp/iframe/player.html?width=500&height=375&auto=0&vid=t0345tr0lmf

Lesley Stahl: Well, congratulations, Mr. Trump.

主持人（Lesley Stahl）: 恭喜你，特朗普先生

Donald Trump: Thank you.

特朗普：谢谢。

Lesley Stahl: You’re president-elect.

主持人: 你现在已经当选总统了。

Donald Trump: Thank you.

特朗普: 谢谢。

Lesley Stahl: How surprised were you?

主持人: 大选当晚，听说你完全保持沉默。是因为你意识到这件事关系有多巨大吗？

Donald Trump: I think so, it’s enormous. I’ve done a lotta big things, I’ve never done anything like this. It is so big, it is so-- it’s so enormous, it’s so amazing.

特朗普: 是的，这件事关系巨大。我干过许多大事，但这种事还是头一次，这事太大了，太……非常巨大，简直令人惊叹。

Lesley Stahl: It kind of just took your breath away? Couldn’t talk?

主持人: 所以这事让你难以呼吸，一时失语？

Donald Trump: A li-- a little bit, a little bit. And I think-- I realized that this is a whole different life for me now.

特朗普: 有一点……就一点，就一点点。而且我意识到，我将迎来崭新的人生。

（二）希拉里和克林顿的电话

Lesley Stahl: Hillary called you. Tell us about that phone call.

主持人: 希拉里给你打了电话，跟我们说说电话的事。

Donald Trump: So Hillary called and it was a lovely call and it was a tough call for her, I mean, I can imagine. Tougher for her than it would have been for me. And for me, it would have been very, very difficult. She couldn’t have been nicer. She just said, “Congratulations, Donald, well done.” And I said, “I want to thank you very much, you were a great competitor.” She is very strong and very smart.

特朗普: 希拉里打电话来，蛮友好的。但我能想象，打这个电话对她来说有多么艰难。如果换做我打电话祝贺她胜选，我觉得非常非常难。而她打电话给我，其实还更难一些。但她简直不能再友善了，她说：“祝贺你，唐纳德，干得漂亮。”我说：“我要感谢你，你是个伟大的对手。”她非常强大，非常聪明。

Lesley Stahl: It was a pretty nasty campaign. Do you regret any of the things you said about her?

主持人: 这场竞选其实蛮脏的（nasty）。你后悔对她说过那些话吗？

Donald Trump: Well, it was a double-side nasty. I mean they were tough and I was tough and-- do I regret? I mean, I’m sitting here with you now and we’re gonna do a great job for the country. We’re going to make America great again, I mean, that’s what-- it-- it began with that and that’s where we are right now. There are so many--

特朗普: 嗯，只能说两边都很脏吧。对手很强硬，我也很强硬，至于我后不后悔，反正现在是我在接受你的采访，而且我们要向国家交出令人满意的答卷，我们要让美国重新伟大。这是我们的初心，也是我们目前要做的事，有太多……

（三）和奥巴马的会面

Lesley Stahl: 90 minutes. You were scheduled for what? 15?

主持人: 你们聊了90分钟。最初的日程安排只有15分钟吧？

Donald Trump: This was just going to be a quick little chat and it lasted close to an hour and a half. And it could have gone on for four hours. I mean it was-- just-- in fact, it was almost hard breaking it up because we had so many things to say. And he told me-- the good things and the bad things, there are things that are tough right now--

特朗普: 本来我们只准备很简短地聊聊，结果一聊就是一个半小时，而且其实可以一直聊下去，四个小时也没问题。其实，很难具体讲聊了哪些方面，因为聊的事情太多了。他告诉我一些好事情，一些坏事情，现在有很多棘手的事情。

Lesley Stahl: Like what?

主持人: 比如什么？

Donald Trump:  Well, look I don’t want to divulge, but we talked about the Middle East, that’s tough. It’s a tough situation. I wanted to get his full view and I got his, you know I got a good part of his view. And I like having that because I’m going to be inheriting that in a short period of time. I found him to be terrific. I found him to be-- very smart and very nice. Great sense of humor, as much as you can have a sense of humor talking about tough subjects, but we were talking about some pretty tough subjects.

特朗普: 我不想泄露太多，但我们谈了中东问题，这非常棘手，当地情况很难处理，我想全面听取奥巴马的意见，他跟我说了，我了解了他大部分想法。我蛮喜欢这样。因为很快就要接手这些工作。他是个很棒的人，我觉得他非常聪明，人也很好，很有幽默感，在谈论棘手问题时还能保持幽默感。我们聊的问题都蛮棘手的。

Lesley Stahl: You looked pretty sober sitting there in the Oval Office, did something wash over you or—

主持人: 你在白宫时看上去很清醒，是遇到什么事让你清醒过来，还是……

Donald Trump: No, I think I’m a sober person. I think the press tries to make you into something a little bit different. In my case, a little bit of a wild man. I’m not. I’m actually not. I’m a very sober person. But it was respect for the office, it was respect for the president. Again, I never met him before, but we had-- we had a very good chemistry going. And-- and I really found—it might not be that I agree with him, but I really found the conversation unbelievably interesting.

特朗普: 不，我本来就是个清醒的人。我觉得媒体总是试图把人塑造得脱离原型。就我而言，媒体给我勾勒出一副狂人形象，但事实上那并不是我，我是个随时保持清醒的人。媒体这次给我正面形象，还是出于对白宫和总统的尊敬。回到奥巴马，我以前没跟他打过交道，但我们相处得不错。我觉得，虽然不一定完全同意他的看法，但想不到，跟他对话还真挺有意思的。

Lesley Stahl: Do you think that-- that your election is a repudiation of his presidency?

主持人: 你有没有这种感觉，你的竞选，是对他总统任期的一种否定？

Donald Trump: No, I think it’s a moment in time where politicians for a long period of time have let people down. They’ve let ‘em down on the job front. They’ve even let ‘em down in terms of the war front. You know, we’ve been fighting this war for 15 years-- We’ve spent $6 trillion in the Middle East, $6 trillion, we could have rebuilt our country twice. And you look at our roads and our bridges and our tunnels and all of the-- and our airports are, like, obsolete. And I think it was just a repudiation of what’s been taking place over a longer period of time than that.

特朗普: 不，我认为他代表了一个时刻，但其实长期以来，政客们一直让人民感到失望。在就业方面，人民很失望；在战争前线，政客也让人民失望。这场战争我们打了15年……我们在中东花了6万亿美元，6万亿，这笔钱足够我国重建两遍。可你看看我们的道路、桥梁和隧道，还有机场，都过时了。如果说我代表着某种否定，那就是对长期以来美国政治状况的否定。

（四）担任总统后，是否会兑现参选期间许下的承诺？

https://v.qq.com/txp/iframe/player.html?width=500&height=375&auto=0&vid=e0345x8khg9

Lesley Stahl: You know, you surprised everyone by winning the primaries, beating 17 other Republicans or 16, whatever-- people are really surprised that you won this election. Are people going to be surprised about how you conduct yourself as president?

主持人: 你在初选中获胜，让所有人感到意外，你战胜了十六七位共和党竞选人，你最终赢得选举，大家都很惊讶。你担任总统后的表现，是否还会让人们惊讶？

Donald Trump: You know, I’ll conduct myself-- in a very good manner, but depends on what the situation is, sometimes you have to be rougher. When I look at-- when I look at the world and you look at how various places are taking advantage of our country, and I say it, and I say it very proudly, it’s going to be America first. It’s not going to be what we’re doing—we, we’ve lost-- we’re losing this country. We’re losing this country. That’s why I won the election. And by the way, won it easily, I mean I won easily.

特朗普: 我会好好表现的，但要视情况而定，有时候你得更强硬些。每当我看到世界上，许多国家占我们的便宜，我就会骄傲地说，我们要把美国摆到第一位。我们现在的做法是不行的，我们正在失去这个国家，国将不国，这是我取得胜利的原因，轻易取胜的原因。我赢得很轻松，这很能说明问题。

Lesley Stahl: Are you going to sometimes have that same rhetoric that you had on the stump? Or are you going to reign it in?

主持人: 你未来会延续竞选演说时那种言辞吗？还是会有所克制？

Donald Trump: Well, sometimes you need a certain rhetoric to get people motivated. I don’t want to be just a little nice monotone character and in many cases I will be.

特朗普: 有时候你得用点话术，才能把人动员起来。我不想成为千篇一律的机器人，但今后恐怕有很多那样的场合。

Lesley Stahl: So let’s go through very quickly some of the promises you made and tell us if you’re going to do what you said or you’re going to change it in any way. Are you really going to build a wall?

主持人: 我们快速回顾一下你许下的承诺，然后你告诉我们，你会信守诺言，还是会做出些改变。你真的会修一堵墙吗？

Donald Trump: Yes.

特朗普: 是的。

Lesley Stahl: They’re talking about a fence in the Republican Congress, would you accept a fence?

主持人: 共和党在大会上讨论修栅栏。你接受栅栏的建议吗？

Donald Trump: For certain areas I would, but certain areas, a wall is more appropriate. I’m very good at this, it’s called construction.

特朗普: 在某些地区，我接受；但某些地区还是修墙更合适，毕竟建筑是我的长项。

Lesley Stahl: So part wall, part fence?

主持人: 所以，一部分高墙，一部分栅栏咯？

Donald Trump: Yeah, it could be – it could be some fencing.

特朗普: 可能吧，可能有的地方会修栅栏。

Lesley Stahl: What about the pledge to deport millions and millions of undocumented immigrants?

主持人: 那么你承诺的遣返数百万无证移民呢？

Donald Trump:  What we are going to do is get the people that are criminal and have criminal records, gang members, drug dealers, we have a lot of these people, probably two million, it could be even three million, we are getting them out of our country or we are going to incarcerate. But we’re getting them out of our country, they’re here illegally. After the border is secured and after everything gets normalized, we’re going to make a determination on the people that you’re talking about who are terrific people, they’re terrific people but we are gonna make a determination at that-- But before we make that determination-- Lesley, it’s very important, we want to secure our border.

特朗普: 我们要找出罪犯和有前科的人，帮会成员、贩毒者，这样的人很多，大概有两三百万。我们要是不把他们赶出去，就得把他们关起来。但他们是非法移民，所以我们得把他们赶出去。当边境稳固，所有情况都恢复正常之后，我们再来决定该怎么处理无证移民。我们是好人，他们也是好人，但我们要决定如何处理，在那之前更重要的是保护边境安全。

（五）与共和党和两院的会面

Lesley Stahl: And you’ve got both Houses?

主持人: 两院都支持你吗？

Donald Trump: And I have both Houses and we have the presidency, so we can do things—

特朗普: 除了两院，共和党还有总统，所以我们能有所作为。

Lesley Stahl: You can do things lickety-split.

主持人: 你们可以说干就干。

Donald Trump: It’s been a long time since it’s happened. And they gave me a lot of credit. Don’t forget, I was abused four or five weeks ago, they said I was going to-- instead of having all three, we would lose all three.

特朗普: 美国已经很久没有这样。他们认为这很大程度上应该归功于我。别忘了，四五个星期前，他们是怎么说我的，他们说共和党将输掉总统、参议院和众议院。

（六）将任命反对堕胎权利的法官

Lesley Stahl: During the campaign, you said that you would appoint justices who were against abortion rights. Will you appoint-- are you looking to appoint a justice who wants to overturn Roe v. Wade?

主持人: 在竞选中，你说你将任命反对堕胎权利的法官。你是否会任命有意推翻罗诉韦德案（赋予美国妇女堕胎权的法案）的法官？

Donald Trump: So look, here’s what’s going to happen-- I’m going to-- I’m pro-life. The judges will be pro-life. They’ll be very—

特朗普: 这么说吧，我是反堕胎的。法官也将是反堕胎的，他们将非常……

Lesley Stahl: But what about overturning this law—

主持人: 那你们会推翻这条法案吗？

Donald Trump: Well, there are a couple of things. They’ll be pro-life, they’ll be-- in terms of the whole gun situation, we know the Second Amendment and everybody’s talking about the Second Amendment and they’re trying to dice it up and change it, they’re going to be very pro-Second Amendment. But having to do with abortion if it ever were overturned, it would go back to the states. So it would go back to the states and--

特朗普: 有这么几个方面。我任命的法官将反堕胎，至于持枪权，我们尊重宪法第二修正案。许多人都在谈论第二修正案，并试图肢解它、改变它，我任命的法官将大力支持第二修正案。一旦推翻对人工流产这件事的判决，裁定权将回到各州。

Lesley Stahl: Yeah, but then some women won’t be able to get an abortion?

主持人: 也就是说部分女性将无法进行人流手术？

Donald Trump: No, it’ll go back to the states.

特朗普: 这取决于各州的情况。

Lesley Stahl: By state—no some –

主持人: 不是所有州都同意……

Donald Trump: Yeah. well, they’ll perhaps have to go, they’ll have to go to another state.

特朗普: 对，就是这个意思，她们可能得去另外的州做手术。

Lesley Stahl: And that’s OK?

主持人: 这样做合适吗？

Donald Trump: Well, we’ll see what happens. It’s got a long way to go, just so you understand. That has a long, long way to go.

特朗普: 我们会看看效果如何，你得明白这是个很长的过程，有个很长很长的过程。

（七）回应反特朗普示威游行

Lesley Stahl: There are people, Americans, who are scared and some of them are demonstrating right now, demonstrating against you, against your rhetoric--

主持人: 许多美国人感到恐慌，有人在抗议你，反对你的那套话语。

Donald Trump: That’s only because they don’t know me. I really believe that’s only because—

特朗普: 这是因为他们不了解我，我真的觉得，这是因为……

Lesley Stahl: Well, what do you think they’re demonstrating against?

主持人: 你认为他们在抗议些什么？

Donald Trump: Well, I think in some cases, you have professional protesters. And we had it-- if you look at WikiLeaks, we had--

特朗普: 其实他们当中某些人是专业抗议示威者，真有这么回事，维基解密里提到过……

Lesley Stahl: You think those people down there are—professional?

主持人: 你觉得街上的那些人……都是专业抗议者？

Donald Trump: I think some of them will be professional, yeah--

特朗普: 我是说他们中有些人是专业的。

Lesley Stahl: OK, but what about – they’re in every city. When they demonstrate against you and there are signs out there, I mean, don’t you say to yourself, I guess you don’t, you know, do I have to worry about this? Do I have to go out and assuage them? Do I have to tell them not to be afraid? They’re afraid.

主持人: 可是每个城市都有示威者，当他们抗议你的时候，你看到那些标语。你会不会对自己说，我想你可能不会，会不会问自己，我应该担心吗？应该出去缓和一下局面吗？应该告诉他们不用害怕吗？人们很害怕。

Donald Trump: Don’t be afraid. We are going to bring our country back. But certainly, don’t be afraid. You know, we just had an election and sort of like you have to be given a little time. I mean, people are protesting. If Hillary had won and if my people went out and protested, everybody would say, “Oh, that’s a terrible thing.” And it would have been a much different attitude. There is a different attitude. You know, there is a double standard here.

特朗普: 别害怕，我们将把美国还到大家手上。可以确定的是，无需害怕。大选刚刚结束，我们还需要一点时间。人们在抗议，但如果换成希拉里赢得大选，我的支持者上街游行，大家都会说：“看呐，多么恶劣。”人们整个态度都将大不一样，这种态度差异，体现着双重标准。

Lesley Stahl: Do you want to say anything to those people?

主持人: 你想对这些人说些什么吗？

Donald Trump: I would say don’t do it, that’s terrible, ‘cause I’m gonna bring this country together.

特朗普：我要说的是，别做这种事，那很糟糕。我要团结这个国家。

Lesley Stahl: They’re harassing Latinos, Muslims—

主持人: 他们在骚扰拉丁裔和穆斯林……

Donald Trump: I am so saddened to hear that. And I say, “Stop it.” If it-- if it helps. I will say this, and I will say right to the cameras: Stop it.

特朗普: 听到这样的事我非常伤心，我要说的是，住手。如果我这么说有用，我将对着镜头说：住手。

（八）是否会调查希拉里

Lesley Stahl: Are you going to ask for a special prosecutor to investigate Hillary Clinton over her emails? And are you, as you had said to her face, going to try and put her in jail?

主持人: 你会找特别检察官调查希拉里克林顿的“邮件门”吗？你会像你在她面前说的那样，试图把她关进监狱吗？

Donald Trump: Well, I’ll tell you what I’m going to do, I’m going to think about it. Um, I feel that I want to focus on jobs, I want to focus on healthcare, I want to focus on the border and immigration and doing a really great immigration bill. We want to have a great immigration bill. And I want to focus on all of these other things that we’ve been talking about.

特朗普: 告诉你我的打算，我打算好好想想。我觉得我得把精力放在就业、医疗、边境、移民等问题上来，颁布一套非常棒的移民法案，我们都想要一部非常棒的移民法案，我想把精力放到这些事情上来。

Lesley Stahl: You called her “crooked Hillary,” said you wanted to get in jail, your people in your audiences kept saying, “Lock em’ up.”

主持人: 你把希拉里称作“欺诈的希拉里”，你说要把她关进监狱，你的支持者也一直高喊“把他们关进去”。

Donald Trump: She did some bad things, I mean she did some bad things--

特朗普: 她做过一些坏事，她的确做过一些坏事。

（九）会否让FBI局长辞职、是否会公布税单

Lesley Stahl: FBI director James Comey. Are you going to ask for his resignation?

主持人:你会要求联邦调查局局长（以下简称FBI）詹姆斯·科米辞职吗？

Donald Trump: I think that I would rather not comment on that yet. I don’t-- I haven’t made up my mind. I respect him a lot. I respect the FBI a lot. I think –

特朗普: 我不想谈这件事，我还没想好。我很尊重他，我也很尊重联邦调查局。我觉得……

Lesley Stahl: Even though they leak so much?

主持人: 即使他们造成如此多的信息泄露？

Donald Trump: Well, there’s been a lotta leaking, there’s no question about that. But I would certainly like to talk to him. And see him. This is a tough time for him. And I would like to talk to him before I’d answer a question like that.

特朗普: 的确有信息泄露，这是没有疑问的，但是我想先跟他谈谈，我想见见他。现在对他来说是个艰难时期，在见到他之前我不想回答这样的问题。

Lesley Stahl: Are you gonna release your tax returns?

主持人: 你会公布自己的纳税申报单吗？

Donald Trump: At the appropriate time, I will release them.

特朗普: 我会的，在合适的时候。

（十）赢了以后依然认为体制被操控？

Lesley Stahl: Now, for months, you were running around saying that the system is rigged, the whole thing was rigged. You tweeted once that the Electoral College is a disaster for democracy. So do you still think it’s rigged?

主持人: 几个月来，你一直说，整个体制是被操纵的，你曾在推特上表示选举团对民主体制来说是个灾难性的存在。现在呢？你还这么认为吗？

Donald Trump: I hated-- well, you know, I’m not going to change my mind just because I won. But I would rather see it where you went with simple votes. You know, you get 100 million votes and somebody else gets 90 million votes and you win. There’s a reason for doing this because it brings all the states into play. Electoral College and there’s something very good about that. But this is a different system. But I respect it. I do respect the system.

特朗普: 是的，部分选举点的确被操纵。我讨厌这个体制的某个部分。我不会因为赢得了大选就改变自己的观点。从简单多数的角度来看，如果你得到了1亿票，而另一个人得到了9000万票，于是你就赢了。选举人团存在的原因在于这样可以让所有的州都真正参与到选举中来。选举人团有好的一面，我尊重这种制度安排。

Lesley Stahl: What about vacations? You’re not going to take any vacations? You’ve said that.

主持人: 假期呢？你曾说以后不会休假，是这样吗？

Donald Trump: We have so much work. There’s so much work to be done. And I want to get it done for the people. I want to get it done. We’re lowering taxes, we’re taking care of health care. I mean, there’s just so much to be done. So I don’t think we’ll be very big on vacations, no.

特朗普: 我面前工作堆积如山，太多了。我想把工作都完成。我们要减税，要解决医保问题，美国有太多问题要处理。所以我不会太盼着度假，那样并不可取。

Lesley Stahl: Are you gonna take the salary, the president’s salary?

主持人: 你会接受总统应得的薪水吗？

Donald Trump: Well, I’ve never commented on this, but the answer is no. I think I have to by law take $1, so I’ll take $1 a year. But it’s a -- I don’t even know what it is. Do you know what the salary is?

特朗普: 我还没对此表过态，答案是“不会”。按照法律，我会拿一美元，每年一美元。我不知道该怎么称呼这个钱，你知道吗？

Lesley Stahl: $400,000 you’re giving up.

主持人: 你想放弃每年40万美元的收入？

Donald Trump: No, I’m not gonna take the salary. I’m not taking it.

特朗普: 是的，我不会接受这笔钱。

（十一）如何消灭“伊斯兰国”

Lesley Stahl: You have said that you’re gonna destroy ISIS. Now, how are you going to?

主持人: 你说过你将会摧毁ISIS，你打算怎么做？

Donald Trump: I don’t tell you that. I don’t tell you that. I’m not like the people going in right now and fighting Mosul and they announced it four months before they went into Mosul and everybody now is -- it’s a tough fight because, number one, the people from the --leaders of ISIS have left. What do you-- why do I have to tell you that?

特朗普: 这我不能告诉你。目前我不希望有人加入到摩苏尔的斗争中来，在他们进入摩苏尔4个月之前就高调地打草惊蛇，如今大家……这是一场艰苦的战斗，首先，来自……的人--ISIS的领导人已经离开，等等，我为什么要告诉你这些。

（十二）怎么处理奥巴马医改

Lesley Stahl: Let me ask you about Obamacare, which you say you’re going to repeal and replace. When you replace it, are you going to make sure that people with pre-conditions are still covered?

主持人: 那让我们谈谈奥巴马医改计划，你曾经说过你将会废除并且取代它，当你取代它的时候，你能确保有前提条件的人们仍然被覆盖到吗？

Donald Trump: Yes. Because it happens to be one of the strongest assets.

特朗普: 对，因为他恰好也是最庞大的资产之一。

Lesley Stahl: You’re going to keep that?

主持人: 你们打算保留下来？

Donald Trump: Very much try and keep that. Adds cost, but it’s very much something we’re going to try and keep.

特朗普: 尽量保存下来，尽管会增加成本，但是有很多东西我们希望能尝试和保持。

Lesley Stahl: And there’s going to be a period if you repeal it and before you replace it, when millions of people could lose -– no?

主持人: 在你废除和完全取代它之前还得有一段时间，这段时间内人们会不会？

Donald Trump: No, we’re going to do it simultaneously. It’ll be just fine. We’re not going to have, like, a two-day period and we’re not going to have a two-year period where there’s nothing. It will be repealed and replaced. And we’ll know. And it’ll be great health care for much less money. So it’ll be better health care, much better, for less money. Not a bad combination.

特朗普: 不会，两者将会同时进行，不管是两天还是两年，它最终将被废除和替代，我们将花更少的钱实现更好的医疗保障，所以它将是更好的医疗保健，花更少的钱，而不是恶性的合并。

英文来源：CBS News

中文内容转自观察者网

翻译：杨晗轶、马力

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